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  #1  
Old 09-24-2016, 12:37 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default C02 tank/air tank questions for build

Hello,

Sign guy here,

So I have decided that my second build will be powered by x2 4500 PSI C02 tanks.


My main issue is how does the tank systems work crazy as it sounds I've have never installed a paintball tank before so I am highly unaware how the release systems set up.

What parts would I need to activate the c02 vs a standard air tank.

From my knowledge, air tank (lb) is < a c02 tank on pressure


The break down of psi to pounds is very so much differant I do know the starting of this system will require me to get up to speed of 20mph before engaging the system as a booster.


I would prefer higher pressure vs lower pressure and less weight over tank weight so c02 is the best option.


Last what would be the best hose line system for this bike I would like silicone hoses or pex fittings vs standard compressed type lines.


This budget will have to be very low quality.

I also have one last concern I just thought of if a 2t weed eater engine is ran without lubrication wouldn't that cause the rings not to seal overtime then leak out all my c02? Lubrication sounds like a bigger issue if the carb is removed and a oil fitting is attatched over the existing carb position a reed model should allow the intake to suck in oil as needed right?
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  #2  
Old 09-24-2016, 06:18 PM
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Agreen Agreen is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

There are tons of videos on this subject. One person uses a solenoid air valve that threads in where the spark plug would go. A flywheel magnet triggers the solenoid to open, air goes in for about 1/4 of the stroke length, and then shuts. The inertia drives the crank down and back around. Pretty neat.

Another one is a pop valve. Using a bolt threaded in to the top of the piston, it pokes the valve open when it comes up to tdc. Air goes in, same story.

You could probably make a block off plate for the intake, and fill the crank case with some oil. A slinger on the crank wouldn't hurt.

For all that trouble, I'd stick with gas. It costs way more to refill CO2 cans, and your range is limited by air charging stations. But don't let me stop you if that's what you want to do. It does sound pretty cool, and I'm all about cool factor!

https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...k1.kiNbAu2ME-M
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Old 09-24-2016, 06:42 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

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Originally Posted by Agreen View Post
There are tons of videos on this subject. One person uses a solenoid air valve that threads in where the spark plug would go. A flywheel magnet triggers the solenoid to open, air goes in for about 1/4 of the stroke length, and then shuts. The inertia drives the crank down and back around. Pretty neat.

Another one is a pop valve. Using a bolt threaded in to the top of the piston, it pokes the valve open when it comes up to tdc. Air goes in, same story.

You could probably make a block off plate for the intake, and fill the crank case with some oil. A slinger on the crank wouldn't hurt.

For all that trouble, I'd stick with gas. It costs way more to refill CO2 cans, and your range is limited by air charging stations. But don't let me stop you if that's what you want to do. It does sound pretty cool, and I'm all about cool factor!

https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...k1.kiNbAu2ME-M

The solinoid the first one sounds good off the magneto problem is stopping the flow as most kill switches are 1 wire for weed eaters if I'm going to be loud and epic it's best to do compressed air, with weed eater.


Air charge stations are no threat gas isn't the way to go tired of stupid ended theives so pure air is what I really like, to top that off I am welding in a new crank so the air will be used sparingly prefered going up hill, or on a flat strip to prepare a nice morning pedal my bike is as bald as a eagal right now. No turning back, full green power.
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Last edited by TheSignGuy; 09-24-2016 at 06:51 PM.
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  #4  
Old 09-24-2016, 07:58 PM
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Agreen Agreen is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

The kill switch can work the same way as on the gas engine. Short the coil output or ground it, no voltage potential is felt on the solenoid. With the air solenoid shut, the engine quits. The biggest hurdle I think will be throttle. You'll find that a ball valve is terrible at throttling flow, but still easier to control on a bike than a globe valve (like a water spigot).
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Old 09-24-2016, 08:38 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

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Originally Posted by Agreen View Post
The kill switch can work the same way as on the gas engine. Short the coil output or ground it, no voltage potential is felt on the solenoid. With the air solenoid shut, the engine quits. The biggest hurdle I think will be throttle. You'll find that a ball valve is terrible at throttling flow, but still easier to control on a bike than a globe valve (like a water spigot).

I am thinking the same about the ball check last key, is fitment

Problem I am encountering is the mathematics gearing at the rear end is 24 tooth, if 13,500 is the psi amount given pressure of the tanks, 90 psi is required minimum required for one cycle without load would be my base mileage per psi?

Thinking of adding a mini pressure pump to keep 1 of the three tank charged at at a time the whole rig will be powered by pedaling and recycle it's air so less trips to the air station spending 2 dollars up to 5 a day for refills with a 8 mile range max is the key.


It's pure green friendly, this rig will still beat the old engine anyway 15.5mph was the limit on the old engine the gearing for the front sprocket would have to be fairly light after accessories are added.


I'll repost pictures of the frame bare soon, I believe a special made tank will help as well so the usage of a manual bicycle pump would be cool.
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Old 09-24-2016, 08:43 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agreen View Post
The kill switch can work the same way as on the gas engine. Short the coil output or ground it, no voltage potential is felt on the solenoid. With the air solenoid shut, the engine quits. The biggest hurdle I think will be throttle. You'll find that a ball valve is terrible at throttling flow, but still easier to control on a bike than a globe valve (like a water spigot).


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Old 09-26-2016, 08:19 PM
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Tony01 Tony01 is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

I would avoid any compressed air tanks and such.. Be pretty bad in an accident... and believe me you will have accidents.. I've lowsided twice in the last two weeks..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQFphkoiq3g
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  #8  
Old 09-26-2016, 08:30 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

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Originally Posted by Tony01 View Post
I would avoid any compressed air tanks and such.. Be pretty bad in an accident... and believe me you will have accidents.. I've lowsided twice in the last two weeks..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQFphkoiq3g
........ I've never had a cycle related accident under gas operated conditions, only on pure pedals across steel plates after peeing rain. I've been debating this in addition to debatin, I've also have to consider in long range conditions which include frame swap. Pedals are manditory in a way
Even if pedal and fan power which of corse won't effect it's legality there is room for plenty ideas, carry electric has speed limitations by weight and power. Gas is kind of funny off the hp system, air explodes, and ccs really depend on shaft size systems. To small shaft snap and goodbye, too big hp even 1.5hp may be two big cc 13-17cc is in 1 hp.
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Last edited by TheSignGuy; 09-26-2016 at 08:35 PM.
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  #9  
Old 09-26-2016, 11:10 PM
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Springfieldscooter Springfieldscooter is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

Tony is correct. 4000 psi is a lot of air. In the event of a failure, its like a 40 lb. bullet. Ive seen one that experienced sudden valve failure, and it sent the tank completely through a concrete wall. Imagine the tank getting hit by a SUV at 30mph or greater....

My airgun tank is wraped in carbon fiber, to help hold the metal in the event of a failure.

Also, why use CO2?.

High end Airguns use high pressure air (HPA). Not co2..... Co2 is slightly more expensive, and produces different pressures according to the tanks temperature. In colder climates, the pressure really suffers. HPA can be filled using a special air compressor, whereas co2 would reguire a steady supply of co2.

Lastly, all of these (HPA and co2) tanks have a shelf life. They are certified. They must pass a hydro test every 5 years as I recall. And after 15 years as I recall, the tank becomes useless. Some people that own their own HPA compressor and/or co2 supply will continue filling them despite their expiration date, but its very risky. If you rely on an external source for air or co2, they most certainly will not fill a expired tank.

Just food for thought!
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  #10  
Old 10-02-2016, 02:48 PM
TheSignGuy TheSignGuy is offline
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Default Re: C02 tank/air tank questions for build

Quote:
Originally Posted by Springfieldscooter View Post
Tony is correct. 4000 psi is a lot of air. In the event of a failure, its like a 40 lb. bullet. Ive seen one that experienced sudden valve failure, and it sent the tank completely through a concrete wall. Imagine the tank getting hit by a SUV at 30mph or greater....

My airgun tank is wraped in carbon fiber, to help hold the metal in the event of a failure.

Also, why use CO2?.




High end Airguns use high pressure air (HPA). Not co2..... Co2 is slightly more expensive, and produces different pressures according to the tanks temperature. In colder climates, the pressure really suffers. HPA can be filled using a special air compressor, whereas co2 would reguire a steady supply of co2.

Lastly, all of these (HPA and co2) tanks have a shelf life. They are certified. They must pass a hydro test every 5 years as I recall. And after 15 years as I recall, the tank becomes useless. Some people that own their own HPA compressor and/or co2 supply will continue filling them despite their expiration date, but its very risky. If you rely on an external source for air or co2, they most certainly will not fill a expired tank.

Just food for thought!


I don't think I will finish presuming the rebuild more interested in a custom build at this point may slam the chopper frame into a old vintage tandem frame and build fresh stay tuned for my latest post.
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