Good brakes?

[spad4me]

I just ordered a rear hub brake .
.Brake Rear Roller BR-IM70-R M10 NuVinci: Staton Inc
Then I found a thread about Kool Pads .
I am going through the wally world brand of cantilever brake pads like crazy.
I was going to buy a 130 dollar front wheel and brake hub to go with the rear brake hub. .
I am going to try the rear hub and front and rear set of kool pads.
I allready utilize the fromt wheel brace and levered brake arms.

[reb1]

Make sure you get the salmon colored ones. They use iron oxide in the compound. You should use a good quality V brakes like a shimano type or better. There is a product called a travel agent that will increase the amount of cable your brakes pull and will give more solid stopping. Using a brake booster will also help by keeping the brake bosses from spreading out when you apply the brakes.
http://www.cambriabike.com/shopexd.asp?id=40902-Travel+Agent+Brake+Pulley+With++Adjuster

There is also a very good article on adjusting the brakes. Adjusting Direct-pull Cantilever Bicycle Brakes ("V-Brakes ®")

[Goat Herder]

You know there is gotta be a reason why true motorcycles don't use rim brakes.

[reb1]

Motorcycles are built heavier and intended for higher speeds. Bicycles are built for efficiency with human power.
Drum brakes have been available for many years. The types of bicycles that use these brakes have just recently started to be marketed in the US. These are still not as powerful as a good rim brake. They are used by commuters in Europe mostly where there is flatter ground and not at high speed.
Disk brakes did not get popular until recently. There are only a couple of them that I would consider for tandem or motorized bicycle use and these are very expensive.
A major problem with having stronger safer drum or disk brakes is the weight. For drum or disk brakes you need a stronger fork and rear stays. This adds weight and reduces the comfort of the bicycles that do not have shocks. All except a couple of the disk brakes available will fail due to heat coming down a steep canyon with a tandem bicycle. This is because they did not make the rotors heavy enough. I use hydraulic rim brakes and a drum on the rear that is used for a drag to control speed and keep the heat of the rims and allow me to rest my hands when coming down a canyon.

[Goat Herder]

Originally Posted by reb1

Motorcycles are built heavier and intended for higher speeds. Bicycles are built for efficiency with human power.
Drum brakes have been available for many years. The types of bicycles that use these brakes have just recently started to be marketed in the US. These are still not as powerful as a good rim brake. They are used by commuters in Europe mostly where there is flatter ground and not at high speed.
Disk brakes did not get popular until recently. There are only a couple of them that I would consider for tandem or motorized bicycle use and these are very expensive.
A major problem with having stronger safer drum or disk brakes is the weight. For drum or disk brakes you need a stronger fork and rear stays. This adds weight and reduces the comfort of the bicycles that do not have shocks. All except a couple of the disk brakes available will fail due to heat coming down a steep canyon with a tandem bicycle. This is because they did not make the rotors heavy enough. I use hydraulic rim brakes and a drum on the rear that is used for a drag to control speed and keep the heat of the rims and allow me to rest my hands when coming down a canyon.

Why are disk brakes the common staple of a down hill competition bike? If you want good brakes guy's use what they are using! Not some tiny rotor set up.

I have been riding with both Hayes hydraulic with 203mm rotors , and Avid BB7s 203mm as well . They work flawless in rain snow or shine. There are a bunch of folks using rotors that are too small for down hill competition or a motor. Plus there are some shotty calipers out there as well? MINE ARE NOT

Ok gotta ask why do you need a hydraulic set up for V brakes? That weighs too much?

I beg to differ on your weight scenario.

Disk brakes don't weigh any more than hydraulic V brakes. Especially the Avid BB7s I use with 203 mm rotors that are not hydraulic.


Ok Here is another one I have had V brakes hot enough to see smoke come off the pads. Giving the different tension on the spokes that lead to having to re true the wheel ever so slightly. I just don't think that ever was a good design. We are not talking about bicycles anymore.

I have yet to warp a rotor as I have used the correct size for the application. My wheels have never been so straight!

Besides, from an engineering standpoint, aluminum is a lousy brake surface. Little rubber pads wear out fast! If they are hard enough to last? Your rim is wearing out sintered metallic pads on steel rotors last a lot longer. [Quoted from elsewhere]

Why do race cars use disk brakes and not drum brakes? snork

Can someone show me a down hill mountain bike with V Brakes that is practical? snork

When v brakes have their death grip on the rims and you are going through a corner or bumps that does terrible things to a spoke set up[think warping]. They are better served to let flex naturally. That also allows better traction over terrain. True nice handling down hill bikes and motorcycles work this way and the wheels stay straight.

These are the true pinnacles of design!

Another important thing to say here is we are not talking about bicycles any more...Seriously.
Some of us joined the forum and put motors on them. snork


I can take my Morini build, the bike and I combined at about 375 pounds if I am not carrying any thing. I can stop on a dime all day long . The Morini is a very playful motor! So I do a ton of near panic stops. I have well over 2000 miles on my disk brakes and have not had to do squat to them!! Nada thing at all whatsoever except for very slight cable adjustments that took 2 seconds if that..

For the record I don't run small rotors either[think down hill competition]. BB7's 203mm rotors Love them and there grab and feel to me has totally been fine tunable.

Just saying......

Disk brakes have been around for awhile now. The sad thing is all the folks using undersized rotors. The technology is not that new

Until Wall mart sells a bike with real brakes.........Ha now that was funny!

[Goat Herder]

Now I am not all that familiar with drum or coaster brakes. I still suspect my favorite brake will always be disks in 203mm rotors.

[Kevlarr]

More expensive tandems use a very heavy duty drum brake and it's not part of the hub.
Precision Tandems - Arai Drum Brake Information

Now your first mistake is buying $6 Bell brake pads 'cause they're just rubber and nothing else. Better brake pads make a world of difference.

[Chalo]

Originally Posted by Goat Herder

Why are disk brakes the common staple of a down hill competition bike? If you want good brakes guy's use what they are using!

The bicyclists who use their brakes the hardest are not downhillers-- when you're headed downhill on a normal length bicycle, you can't even use all that much braking power before the bike will tip up.

Tandemists have the most demanding braking application in the cycling world. They are packing twice the normal amount of weight on two wheels, and their bikes have very long wheelbases. They won't tip up under hard braking, so the brakes can be applied harder than a single bike's brakes.

Tandemists mostly use rim brakes. The ones who are serious about mountain riding generally have two rim brakes for stopping, plus at least one drum brake for steady drag on downhills. Disc brakes are generally acknowledged to be inadequate to cope with the heat loads a tandem can impose-- good ones will stop plenty hard for a time, but then they can overheat and fail.

Chalo

[Goat Herder]

Your still horking rim's I don't see any real motorcycles or cars with rim brakes. While folks continue to use undersized rotors and inferior calipers the comparison is null and void. Use the right disk set up for the right job. My observations were made on a extreme circumstance. Hot rod motor very heavy bike at a suspected total weight of 375 pounds.

I beat this thing and tried it out thoroughly. There was no fade for me to worry about.

Disk brakes will always get a bad name from folks using a inferior set up just like rim brakes will.

[Chalo]

Originally Posted by Goat Herder

When v brakes have their death grip on the rims and you are going through a corner or bumps that does terrible things to a spoke set up[think warping]. They are better served to let flex naturally. That also allows better traction over terrain. True nice handling down hill bikes and motorcycles work this way and the wheels stay straight.

This is spectacularly fanciful thinking. With a rim brake, force is transmitted from the tire, to the rim, to the brake. All the spokes have to do is position the rim, which is what they always do. Hard rim braking does not have a significant effect on spoke tension.

With a disc or drum brake, force must be transmitted from the tire, to the rim, through the spokes, through the hub shell, and on to the drum or disc rotor. The spokes see substantial changes in tension from braking, and the hub must be quite a bit stronger and stiffer than a hub used with a rim brake.

The Buell Lightning motorcycle used a brake rotor attached to the rim, and it was not just to allow the rotor to be bigger. The idea was that if braking force didn't have to be transmitted through the hub and spokes, the wheel could be made lighter but still reliable.



Chalo