Electric Drag Bike

allen_okc · Mar 22, 2011

i guess its time to update everyone here on the drag scooter - kim and thud knows what going on but here it is for the rest you all...

first of to Kim Thud EV Ed, this bike might stand a chance to succeed - Thank You fellows...

flex man · Apr 1, 2011

Hi
You need a disconect button its a giant button that completly disconects the circut from battery to controller so if controller frys you can still shut down...
Just My 2 Cents Flex Man...
look up places that supplys solar race car parts.....

allen_okc · Apr 4, 2011

thank you flex - but im already there. NEDRA and NHRA requires a break away key system that shuts down everything - im using a magnetic break away key switch from a scadoo...

ive also revamp the rear part of the frame and now have the motorcycle wheel and motor mounted...

next step is baterries batteries batteries...

flex man · Apr 4, 2011

Hi
If this is strickly a drag bike do a run then charge and not a cruzing bike. you know just around the neighborhood I would use ulta capacitors make a pack that will hold enough power to do the run .Then charge it in the pitts. I spoke with a college professor that taught a electrical engerining class and they had a special projects club .They made a electric drag car that they hold all records
in there class.Powered with a pack made with only ultra capacitors I forget how many Kw. it was but that info would do you no good because that was for a car. Anyway you wont get batteries to dump as fast as ultra capacitors..
If you are looking for all out power this is the way to go. Sure you could make a batterie pack if its going to be a lithium pack pricie I know first hand on that.
or you could use the ultra capacitors in front of your lithium pack for instant take off then then batteries take over also ultra capacitors will constantly be
charging for next blast off...Just my 2 cents Thanks Flex Man[Mr Metalmorphic]

allen_okc · Apr 4, 2011

thats very interesting, i had discussions about the lithium batteries before, im still not sure about them. im trying to learn, but the whole ideal that RC car batteries would give me the power to operate a 19 horsepower mars motor at its max level just doesnt seem right...

ive talked to other EV drag racers and showed them batteries that i was told to use, and they all disagree with them...

example - HobbyKing Online R/C Hobby Store : Turnigy nano-tech 5000mah 6S 45~90C Lipo Pack

which is great for bicycles, but for drag bikes and motorcycles...

Headway 38120S 10ah (LiFePO4)

and my choice;
GBS 40ah (4-cell Pack)

and my choice for lead batteries...
Odyssey PC680 Battery - Free Shipping: BatteryMart.com

i geuss its a matter of preference - if i cant be settled on the lithium batteries without someone giving a clear how to lay these batteries out for my particle requirement... i'll be sticking with the lead batteries - everyone seems to have different opinions about it.

the people who actually drag race with electric vehicles and have experience with them, i have to trust their opinion... the hobby batteries for a drag race situation is a joke, but the price seems to be right, and thats the opinion of other EV drag racers who are seasoned, just ask the lawless team, what batteries they use...

your ideal of using capacitors has been an ideal created outside of the box and i like that - i most definetley will keep that in mind... got any more info about it, schematic?

but in answer to your question - this bike will only run 660 feet or the full quarter mile. no trips to the supermarket or to work, just a straight line down the track...

flex man · Apr 4, 2011

Hi
Do your self a favor check into the ultra capacitors the size pack you will need will be small and lite . Should be able to re charge in 5 min..Lead acid so so heavy.You know the old saying shaving weight is adding horse power...
you could maybe have one built for under $1000. Nobody ever said going electric is cheeper as far as set up.........Speed Cost$$$$$$$$$$

allen_okc · Apr 4, 2011

man i hear you - im in favor of the lithium batteries for that reason alone... i would lose 50 pounds with the lithium batteries... and thats a very substantial amount...

the GBS 40 ah 4 cell pack is still my choice, because of the over and under load protection... i still have time, but i would like to start collecting the batteries this friday... believe me i have been asking everyone for the perfect batteries for drag racing...

but at this point im just blowing smoke, due to the lack of knowledge of lithium batteries - im just going by what others are saying...

flex man · Apr 4, 2011

Hi
tHE WEAK spot on the li poly is the tabs if you try to use those kind of batteries you have to hard mount the cells but the tabs are still the weak spot. That why tesla motors uses single cells li ion and they series them to get the voltage and parrarel them for amprage. for example for a 48 volt system I would go 12s by 10p in one pack but you a high c rating I ran 4 packs on the Jin Bike...you also need a batterie spot welder to assyemble
these kind of packs...I would draw you a picture but I signed all kinds of non disclosure papers.and I dont want to be sued....Flex...........

allen_okc · Apr 4, 2011

thats another thing that bothers me - the connections are way small. its hard to believe that i need a 2 gauge wire to the motor, but the connecting wires between the batteries are 10 gauge at most, thats where it seems to be the weak link... is that what you mean by tabs?

dont worry bud, somehow i'll figure it out... i have too... too much money in it to back out now...

flex man · Apr 5, 2011

Hi
what i meant about tabs is if you take one of the packs apart and look how they put them togather the tin is 1 /4 wide batteries have litte very thin and
most are are not even battarie tach weled they put tin togather then they fold it and fold it again then they soldier on to that so the thin piece of tin is the weak spot and when I mentioned hard mountng get like a 1/8 inch thich piece of brass to soldier the tab directly to that when they fold those made up packs if you pull high amps the tabs start to get hot because of bad rolled up batteries some time bad soldier joints when you pull big amps fast if the connection isnt perfect the tab will burn ouf that cell..

allen_okc · Apr 5, 2011

wow - i didnt know that, i guess it would be best to build my own battery pack using as much heavy duty wiring as possible.

i would think that the brass tabs with a thick enough gauge would be best...

that would be a good time to implement the capacitor theory and add regulators to protect the batteries... i would feel better doing this compared to a premade pack... i would still like more information about the capacitor theory.

flex man · Apr 6, 2011

Hi Allen
The capacitors I refer to are ultra capacitors like regular capacitors on steriods
check them out . you wont need a regulator between pack and capacitors if done right ..Batteries- ultra capacitors- speed controller- motor.......hopefully your controler can take it.................I cant tell you more than this because of Non Desclosure agreement......Flex.........
The way you make your batterie pack is very important also run wires so you can keep cells balanced when charging........KEY to keeping your batteries in good shape...........and you need a capable charger.........

flex man · Apr 6, 2011

your not replacing the tabs .........just securing them to brass ...taking the tabs
leaving them flat for more solider area after that make sure you secure the batteries there cant be any movement between solider joint and batterie. also make a pack that is got air flow for cooling
batteries get hot .............

flex man · Apr 6, 2011

If using li ion cells dont solider to them the right way is batterie spot welder
they dont like that much heat put to them..........

allen_okc · Apr 6, 2011

Thank You Flex Man - im gonna be ordering batteries this friday...

i'll start with 16 of these to create a 48 volt battery pack...

Manzanita Micro

so this is the way im going, for several reasons...

flex man · Apr 7, 2011

Hi
Be carefull befor you assemble plan well get everything layed out with the right polarity and go slow and safely nothing worst than a dead short flash in your face..
Flex...

allen_okc · Apr 7, 2011

flex man said:
Hi
Be carefull befor you assemble plan well get everything layed out with the right polarity and go slow and safely nothing worst than a dead short flash in your face..
Flex...

i hear that - thats what scares me the most with lithium batteries... ive seen what they can do as far as damage is concern...

its going to be worth it - after this season with the drag bike, then all the components will be transfered over to a custom chopper motorcycle... from which i will ride daily to work and such... but thats another story...

EspenK · Jun 4, 2011

Hi Allen okc, sweet ride! What kind of charger do you need to charge your batteries?

Best,
EspenK

Recumpence · Jun 5, 2011

Honestly, you really should go with lipo. They are much lighter, smaller, and cheaper than any other chemistry out there, if you shop around. They are also FAR higher C rating. I have no clue why other guys have told you not to buy them. I have pulled 40C from these packs without hurting them. Also, do not waste your time with Ultra-capacitors. They are WAY too costly for any benefit you may gain. Besides, you cannot run them without a decent pack anyway. They cannot be run by themselves because the voltage drops linearly with the state of charge.

Nic Case (top speed RC car world record holder) is a good friend of mine. We have gone through this battery chemistry and Ultra-capacitor discussion for hours and hours. In the end, we both run Lipo packs exclusively. Do yourself a favor and go with the Hobby City lipos. You will NOT be disappointed.

Matt

Electric Drag Bike

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