50 State Legal if gas engine is not part of drivetrain right?

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miked826

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If a gas engine is not actually propelling the bike or part of the drive-train, then it would be legal in any state or country right? LOL
 

mew905

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If you're talking hybrid, technically yes, but whatever powers the drive train has to fall under the local laws, some places are just 32km/h (20 mph), some are 32km pedal assisted, some are 32km/h 500w, some are even 32km/h 200w (barely enough to get moving). Here in saskatchewan, police figure its safer to be able to keep up with traffic, rather than getting road-rage drivers that rip around you, or even try to push you off the road (I had one guy last year with my first bike yell at me saying if I cant keep up with traffic, to get on the sidewalk, I just looked at him and smiled)
 

miked826

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If you're talking hybrid, technically yes, but whatever powers the drive train has to fall under the local laws, some places are just 32km/h (20 mph), some are 32km pedal assisted, some are 32km/h 500w, some are even 32km/h 200w (barely enough to get moving). Here in saskatchewan, police figure its safer to be able to keep up with traffic, rather than getting road-rage drivers that rip around you, or even try to push you off the road (I had one guy last year with my first bike yell at me saying if I cant keep up with traffic, to get on the sidewalk, I just looked at him and smiled)
In The evil Empire State you are "subject to arrest" if the gas engine drives any wheel in any way. The UK is not any friendlier either.

There are different types of hybrids though, one of which includes the gas engine not being connected to the drive-train in any way.

Fair enough then. I can live certainly with that. Cops might not like that Escape Clause, Loop Hole too much, but that's not my problem. LOL
 

miked826

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easy answer, no.

put a gas motor on a bike in california and you need a license.

even if it didn't power the bike and ran a popcorn machine. then you'd need a vendo's license...
If it's not actually "propelling the bike" then it's no different than transporting it?

"and is capable of propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than 30 miles per hour on level ground."

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d01/vc406.htm

Call me crazy, but if the gas engine is not actually connected to the drive-train, the how the h3ll can it propel it?

Come on Baird. You can do better than that! Put your Judge hat on! LOL
 
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miked826

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I'm definitely not saying you won't be able to convince a street cop of the motorized bicycle law as it is written and it's almost guaranteed he will charge you with whatever he can think up, at the time. I have no concerns about that or him. It's what a judge finally rules, that is the only thing I care about, cause his ruling is the only one that even matters.....in the end anyway.

If a cop feels he's been wronged, about a ruling that doesn't go his way in court, then he can right his congressman, to rewrite the law, to include ALL ICE's on bicycles, regardless of their function or configuration. Sounds like a personal problem to me but here's nothing I can do about that, other than smile, as I quietly walk out of the courtroom. LOL
 
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miked826

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As a matter of fact, I have never read a motorized bicycle law in any state or any English speaking country that does not use the "Capable of Propelling" phrase, or something similar to that phrase, when referring to gas engines mounted on a bicycle. It's practically universal. I'm not sure about other non-English speaking, countries but I'm guessing they are all exactly the same.
 

BarelyAWake

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There are different types of hybrids though, one of which includes the gas engine not being connected to the drive-train in any way...
That would be a "series hybrid", it's still connected & is part of the "drive-train" via the electricity it generates - I wouldn't bet on any law enforcement seeing it differently ;)
 

miked826

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That would be a "series hybrid", it's still connected & is part of the "drive-train" via the electricity it generates - I wouldn't bet on any law enforcement seeing it differently ;)
Sure it's electrically connected but it is physically incapable of propelling the bike without some kind of chain or friction drive. The laws of any English speaking country and the 50 states only refer to "Capable of Propelling" .......not whether it is connected either physically or electrically.

The cop surely won't understand that logic though. There's no doubt about it. I wouldn't expect it any other way. LOL
 
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miked826

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Any ICE that is bolted to a bicycle and is not capable of moving or propelling the bike whatsoever, because it has no chain or friction drive to do so with, I'm guessing is legal anywhere on the face of the Earth.......if challenged in a Court of Law?

Until someone decides they don't like bicycles with any bolted on ICE, no matter it's function, and rewrites their laws to specifically cover that? LOL
 

miked826

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I just checked the UK, France, Russia, Germany, USA, NEW YORK STATE, and Oh Canada! None of those have any restrictions, regarding an ICE that is unable to propel a bike.....above zero MPH. Not even NEW YORK STATE. LOL

Looks like New York is about to legalize normal motorized bicycles as long as the engine is 48cc or less. It's in a Bill form right now.
 

miked826

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Holy Frankensteins Monster! LOL

A 1987 Suzuki Savage with a GX200 clone, solely connected to an alternator, to recharge a battery bank, to power an electric motor. Capable of running with or without the GX200 running and only a few MPH slower without the GX200 running. RPM's of GX200 while charging the 48V battery pack = 2400.

 
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miked826

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Ok so Massachusetts has some of the craziest worded motorized bicycle laws I've ever seen and requires you have some kind of moped sticker and it has to pass Fed NHTSA safety rules, regarding a moped, to get that sticker. I'm not sure anything can save you in that state unless you build a full blown moped with all the bells and whistles that they come with.

Nevermind. Massachusetts let's you "certify" your own bike as meeting all Federal standards. Can't beat that I guess.
 
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biknut

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Range you ask? The range is effectively UNLIMITED, as long as you keep gas in the tank and the GX200 doesn't one day decide to blow up on you or quit working for whatever reason. At 2400 RPM's, that might be a while. LOL
How's that different from my bike. I have unlimited range as long as there's gas in the tank too.
 

16v4nrbrgr

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I looked into series hybrid, the problem being that the generators needed make a lot of noise when they are producing peak power. I think a series hybrid would be "legal" in CA if executed right, a big noisy 2 stroke generator dirtbike would probably be illegal. It's all up to each individual officer you encounter if they want to see if it meets regulations after pulling you over.
 

miked826

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I looked into series hybrid, the problem being that the generators needed make a lot of noise when they are producing peak power. I think a series hybrid would be "legal" in CA if executed right, a big noisy 2 stroke generator dirtbike would probably be illegal. It's all up to each individual officer you encounter if they want to see if it meets regulations after pulling you over.
If the gas engine is not "capable of propelling" the bike then there is no law restricting it's use. Not in California or anywhere on the face of the earth for that matter that uses that phrase or similar in it's laws.

I'm gonna guess that when the laws were written, that nobody in their right mind thought anybody would have a gas engine on a bike or motorcycle that's not actually driving the wheel? Cause that would just crazy right? LMAO
 

miked826

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If anyone anywhere has a law or knows a law that prohibits the use of any engine that can not "physically cause the bike to move forward on its own", regardless of the throttle used......because it's not connected to any wheel,
then don't be shy...... just tell me the state or country you're from, and I'll be happy to verify that law for you!
 

miked826

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A 49cc, 4 stoker with stock everything installed would barley be audible at 2400 RPM's and it would last almost 4EVER, always under unchanging stress or load. Minimum battery voltage would rise to at least a 72V pack. 48V is just too slow for me to feel safe with hub motors.

The bike frame would have to be custom made around the 2 motors, unless electric hubs were used. If a Suzuki 650 can hurl itself down the road @ 55 or 65MPH with 48V of SLA's, then how fast would a bicycle go with the same setup except running Lithium instead of SLA?