engine suddenly became very hard to turn over

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peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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Everything was goin fine,I'm an adult but I am using the bike as my primary mode of transportation for the past 3 or 4 days I have had it.

So today I went across town and chained my bike near the beach when I came back the engine turned over and possibly before it fully stabilized I started up a steep hill, I ended up stopping due to traffic and the engine cut off, after this point I was unable to get it to fully turn over, it will stutter a little and not fully turn on, at one point there was dark colored stuff comeing out of the muffler.

I then waited a few hours and petaled home, there was a steep hill goin down about half way the 6 mile ride so I decided to try one more time to turn it over and it worked. when I got home I stopped the engine and decided to see if I could get it to turn and I had no problem. I then waited a few hours and tried again at this point I could get it to sputter a bit but not fully start.

I am useing 16: 1 mix meaning I mix 8oz per 1gallon of gas so far I have burned about a tank and a half of gas.

Now for the things I know I am doin wrong, I am perhaps riden it a little too hard and I believe its possible 3 in 1 might have been used on the chain.

So what is my move to correct this,? I have been trying to find answers but I cannot.
 

GearNut

Active Member
Aug 19, 2009
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It sounds like the carburetor is flooding. Do you have any fuel coming out of the air cleaner?
When you try to start it and it refuses, is the spark plug wet with fuel?
 

peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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nothins leakin out of the air cleaner as far as I can tell and I I did check the spark plug after I tryed once and it seemd fairly dry as near as i could tell, I did change out the fuel line yesterday.

so how is this corrected?
 
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city of angels

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May 24, 2009
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it sound like a carburetor its getting flooded another your oil to gas mixture is too high i recomend 20:1 for breaking the engine what stuff its coming out of the muffler
 

Bikeguy Joe

Godfather of Motorized Bicycles
Jan 8, 2008
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24:1 for break in, and that's crazy rich...40:1 will be sufficient after a tank has been run through the engine. 16:1 is extremely oil rich, and can even cause tuning problems, now and later.

As for the starting/running problem, I think you have crud in the float needle seat, and it may be causing intermittent flooding.
 

peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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so i should drain the tank, lower the mix to around 40:1 which is 3.2oz per gallon if understand correctly and then clean out the needle and cup thingy in the carb, correct?


thanks for your help, I have been enjoining puttering around on this thing since before now.
 

peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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Ok I drained the tank and cleaned out the needle, I did not see anything in there though. I mixed new gas and now it seems to be starting normally, so yay.


I may not have been 100% accurate with my fule mixture though I probubley added closer to 4oz of oil to my gallon of gas, is that ok?
 

KCvale

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2010
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Phoenix,AZ
Is there a little 'test tube' gizmo like you put in a lead acid car battery cell to measure the acid content that will measure the gas/oil mix in a sample right out of the tank or a gas can?

Basically a bike eyedropper like a turkey baster with a little float and calibrations on the outside that would read the oil to gas mix by it's relative density or seperation level?

I could really use that tool right now.
With multiple gas cans from no oil to maybe too much are here, and I am not sure what I have in my tank now.

It is draining into a can along with everything else I have no clue about and making a fresh can of 40:1 to put in, but I would sure like to know what is in that combined can.
If it was a cheap little plastic 'baster' style tool, I'd buy one.

I don't know about you guys, but I seldom run a whole tank to empty to know when I can lighten up the break-in mix in the tank itself, especially running 2 tanks before break-in mix change.
 

peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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I was running 16:1 which was apparently too oil rich, I am unsure if the break in period is over yet or not, I think I ran at least one tanks worth of 16:1 fule mix but there was a very tiny leake in the fule line the very first day, would continuing to use 24:1 longer than you have to cause any troubles?
 
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Bikeguy Joe

Godfather of Motorized Bicycles
Jan 8, 2008
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You can (and many have) broken in their engines at 40:1 or 50:1. Running 24:1 or 32:1 will not hurt a thing and running 16:1 is far worse for one of these More oil in the mix means less fuel in the fuel to air ratio....= lean mix= burn cylinder/piston/rings.
 
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Bikeguy Joe

Godfather of Motorized Bicycles
Jan 8, 2008
11,837
252
63
up north now
Is there a little 'test tube' gizmo like you put in a lead acid car battery cell to measure the acid content that will measure the gas/oil mix in a sample right out of the tank or a gas can?

Basically a bike eyedropper like a turkey baster with a little float and calibrations on the outside that would read the oil to gas mix by it's relative density or seperation level?

I could really use that tool right now.
With multiple gas cans from no oil to maybe too much are here, and I am not sure what I have in my tank now.

It is draining into a can along with everything else I have no clue about and making a fresh can of 40:1 to put in, but I would sure like to know what is in that combined can.
If it was a cheap little plastic 'baster' style tool, I'd buy one.

I don't know about you guys, but I seldom run a whole tank to empty to know when I can lighten up the break-in mix in the tank itself, especially running 2 tanks before break-in mix change.
No such animal that I know of.
 

peppers

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Jul 21, 2010
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I thought at least the jackdonkeys selling them would know what kinda fuel the engine they are selling took but they don't even know what much apparently.
 

KCvale

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2010
3,966
57
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Phoenix,AZ
No such animal that I know of.
I found out how to Make One for Cheap ;-}
The basics anyway, on the testing rules page of an outboard motorboat racing site.

There is enough density change when oil is added to gas to measure with a simple hydrometer, which is what I figured but didn't know for sure if there was enough difference.

Basically an hydrometer is just a stick with a weight on one end and numbers on the side that will semi float in the given liquid.
You float it in the liquid and note the number where the stick comes out of the liquid.
By making test samples of known mix's like 18:1, 25:1, 40:1 50:1 etc. you get the differences between them and un-mixed gas all at the same at the same temp.

That should give you an idea of what is in someones tank or that can of 'mystery mix' by testing a sample of regular gas, then your mystery mix at the same time in the same temp, which is why I asked and went looking for an answer ;-}
 

KCvale

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2010
3,966
57
48
Phoenix,AZ
I thought at least the jackdonkeys selling them would know what kinda fuel the engine they are selling took but they don't even know what much apparently.
You'd think.
The frigg'n owners manual that comes with Grubee motors says 16-18:1 for the 1st 2 tanks, 25:1 after that, but it can be a little less oil with good synthetic oil.

That being the case, I guess the jackdonkeys are the frigg'n people making the motors?
 

Bikeguy Joe

Godfather of Motorized Bicycles
Jan 8, 2008
11,837
252
63
up north now
16:1 would be if you used a motor oil like 10w40.
Don't try it unless you live in a mosquito infested area, and like to de-carbon frequently.