I have a 4 stroke w/ a 4G belt drive mounted on cruiser. I've welded the 1 way bearing solid & everything was great for minute but now it shakes really bad during take off but then smooths out @ about 15 mph... Any Suggestions???
Bad Vibration on take off with a 4G belt drive
- Thread starter Wild Ride Bikes
- Start date
I know you welded yours but you should read this written in another post by BE-tech................I've found that with some of the bearings, the shields are a little tough to get off. You really don't need them as they are just for keeping dirt out of the bearing. Once you make it solid, they will not matter. Re-using them was more of just a way to cover up the JB-Weld blob in the center of the bearing. You can grab a small screwdriver or pic, punch it through the thin metal on the shield, and pry it away from the bearing. It is okay if you damage anything behind it because it's just getting filled with JB weld anyway. Just try to keep the bearing retainer somewhat intact. This will keep the 9 balls inside spaced correctly and keep the inner race properly aligned with the outer race (so your pulley doesn't wobble up and down and vibrate horribly at speed).
hope this will help you
hope this will help you
I had the same set of symptoms with my 4G kit. I'm a heavy guy about 280. I'm running the gear that came with the kit, 48t sprocket, 12t freewheel, 100 driven pulley. My clutch would strain and bounce trying to get engaged because it was had to get me moving. I actually thought my engine mount was coming undone it was so bad.
I found possibly three things to do to get rid of this clutch chatter. I've tried two of these with success.
1. I mounted a 56t rear sprocket which made the gearing very low. I lost speed for sure, but I gained smoothness. Take off from a dead stop without peddling was no problem.
2. I accidentally got oil on my clutch shoes. Take off was a little slower but the engine assembly was very smooth as the shoes were slipping on the bell inside surface. Eventually, the oil will burn off and the clutch will go back to how it was. The fact is, I like the oil on the clutch shoes solution so much, I drilled a small hole in the clutch bell so I could oil it without dissassembly required. I expect to get lots of negative feedback about deliberately oiling the clutch shoes. I don't care because it works well for me.
3. I haven't tried this, just read about it. Shim the springs in your clutch so the clutch won't engage until higher RPMs. That could work well, I don't know for sure.
Whatever you do to solve the vibration problem, if it's coming from your clutch it's very important you get it stopped. Clutch vibration puts great strain on the clutch key and keyway walls. It is possible to damage the keyway to the point where you will need to replace the crankshaft.
Oh, one other way to eliminate clutch chatter would be to peddle like a son of a gun to get speed and then turn the throttle on. I don't care for that idea however. I mean why have a motorbike if you're going to peddle all the time?
Hope some of this prattle helps you.
I found possibly three things to do to get rid of this clutch chatter. I've tried two of these with success.
1. I mounted a 56t rear sprocket which made the gearing very low. I lost speed for sure, but I gained smoothness. Take off from a dead stop without peddling was no problem.
2. I accidentally got oil on my clutch shoes. Take off was a little slower but the engine assembly was very smooth as the shoes were slipping on the bell inside surface. Eventually, the oil will burn off and the clutch will go back to how it was. The fact is, I like the oil on the clutch shoes solution so much, I drilled a small hole in the clutch bell so I could oil it without dissassembly required. I expect to get lots of negative feedback about deliberately oiling the clutch shoes. I don't care because it works well for me.
3. I haven't tried this, just read about it. Shim the springs in your clutch so the clutch won't engage until higher RPMs. That could work well, I don't know for sure.
Whatever you do to solve the vibration problem, if it's coming from your clutch it's very important you get it stopped. Clutch vibration puts great strain on the clutch key and keyway walls. It is possible to damage the keyway to the point where you will need to replace the crankshaft.
Oh, one other way to eliminate clutch chatter would be to peddle like a son of a gun to get speed and then turn the throttle on. I don't care for that idea however. I mean why have a motorbike if you're going to peddle all the time?
Hope some of this prattle helps you.
Thanks for the tips... Clutch chatter does make sense. I also noticed a little play in the pulley/drive sprocket bearing but not sure if that would cause the chattering on take off. I think I'll try your oil trick 1st, it would be the easiest fix. I also like the shimming of the springs idea. Hopefully I get it figured out soon cause the customer plans on picking it up by the end of the week..
Problem solved, if you are experiencing a lot of vibration at take off with the 4G clutch as I was this is most likely caused by a lack of lubrication that in turn caused the shoes to remain stuck open or engaged and they are not sliding back into position. (just as described in scotto's June 2010 post) Try removing the clutch then pads, then grease the guide posts and springs behind each of the pads with a heavy engine grease. This completely eliminated the problem for me.
Good info by all especially Ibedayank. If you pedal up to the speed that your clutch fully engages and then apply the throttle you get almost no clutch slippage. Your clutch life will greatly increase doing this. Also avoid too steep of hills (causing clutch to slip under load for extended period = very fast wear/burnt clutch). The vibrating/shaking of the clutch is also really hard on the shoulder bolts in the clutch and can cause them to shear off where the threaded portion meets the shoulder.
Ok I had gotten a brand new 4G4 4stroke kit with the 80/10 setup from PIRATECYCLES1.COM there awesome at getting the order delivered and promptly. Ok my box of parts and the engine (2 boxes that shipped) were thrown around just alittle during shipment, so I had to make shure that all my stuff was going to be checked and used well and I have been working on this setup for 5 weeks or so after work getting these parts ready to be run and started to be used but setup to be run for the longest life to get out of them the following is what I found.
1. I made a side shimmed style 1/4" plate steel strap for my mount plate up front. I have a Electra frame. Although if I ordered another motor plate I could use the back smaller Dia. mount up front and swap em out to have a much needed solid mounting. But my mount is more than enough.
2. My jackshaft was loose the fasteners weren't tightened before shipment. I also realized since the 80 tooth pulley was assembled on the trans that the one way bearing maybe loose internally so I will find out when I run my kit how it will respond.
3.The clutch shoes do not make complete contact with the inside of the clutch bell. I shimmed the two to get that linedup. upon wear life down the road the back edge of the bell will make lots of **** for vibrations trying to rip the bell off. It's uneven wear that's it. I found this out by putting the clutch shoe on w/o keyway and placing the bell over it at first.
4. I filled my keyway and finished the fitment like a glove with oil and a whetstone.
5. The clutch shoe assembly has two sides one with threaded holes to use a puller later on in life or a smooth side. My shimming uses the smooth side facing outboard and 2 washers one bronze 3/16" or so and one thin stainless 1/32" about, they both create the way for the shoes and the bell to wear evenly inside not unevenly.
6. I also used real hardware from the hardware store not those silly flathead fasteners. Allen head types 4 for the trans 1 for the clutch bell.
7. I used the supplied thick spacer (???3/8") for inside of the bell's bronzed presto lite bushing and a few small 1/4" washers to get outside of the bushing ( some were filed) and a large 1/4" fender washer to allow the clutch bell from ever coming off. It's a very close tolerance and I used a allen to fasten it.
8. My backside of the trans the thin metal circle I had some broke spots so I just filed all that off.
9. I used x2 1/4" small washers to shim my trans outboard, so the outside face of the bell doesn't rub the vacume cleaner belt and generate any heat to the belt. I also plan to drill the face of my bell to help vent heat and smooth it to eliminate burrs. the x2 1/4" washers on the back of the trans create a vented area also. Furthermore the shimming of the trans helps keep the chain from rubbing the rear tire just alittle goes along way.
10. I had to patience to set this up because I'm that tired of peddaling to work to work more outside.
Thanks all who read I will check this post and make an update after I get this rolling I'm so close to running it.
Cheers to all
1. I made a side shimmed style 1/4" plate steel strap for my mount plate up front. I have a Electra frame. Although if I ordered another motor plate I could use the back smaller Dia. mount up front and swap em out to have a much needed solid mounting. But my mount is more than enough.
2. My jackshaft was loose the fasteners weren't tightened before shipment. I also realized since the 80 tooth pulley was assembled on the trans that the one way bearing maybe loose internally so I will find out when I run my kit how it will respond.
3.The clutch shoes do not make complete contact with the inside of the clutch bell. I shimmed the two to get that linedup. upon wear life down the road the back edge of the bell will make lots of **** for vibrations trying to rip the bell off. It's uneven wear that's it. I found this out by putting the clutch shoe on w/o keyway and placing the bell over it at first.
4. I filled my keyway and finished the fitment like a glove with oil and a whetstone.
5. The clutch shoe assembly has two sides one with threaded holes to use a puller later on in life or a smooth side. My shimming uses the smooth side facing outboard and 2 washers one bronze 3/16" or so and one thin stainless 1/32" about, they both create the way for the shoes and the bell to wear evenly inside not unevenly.
6. I also used real hardware from the hardware store not those silly flathead fasteners. Allen head types 4 for the trans 1 for the clutch bell.
7. I used the supplied thick spacer (???3/8") for inside of the bell's bronzed presto lite bushing and a few small 1/4" washers to get outside of the bushing ( some were filed) and a large 1/4" fender washer to allow the clutch bell from ever coming off. It's a very close tolerance and I used a allen to fasten it.
8. My backside of the trans the thin metal circle I had some broke spots so I just filed all that off.
9. I used x2 1/4" small washers to shim my trans outboard, so the outside face of the bell doesn't rub the vacume cleaner belt and generate any heat to the belt. I also plan to drill the face of my bell to help vent heat and smooth it to eliminate burrs. the x2 1/4" washers on the back of the trans create a vented area also. Furthermore the shimming of the trans helps keep the chain from rubbing the rear tire just alittle goes along way.
10. I had to patience to set this up because I'm that tired of peddaling to work to work more outside.
Thanks all who read I will check this post and make an update after I get this rolling I'm so close to running it.
Cheers to all
I figured it out... it was actually pretty simple. The clutch pads had a layer of crud on them (from excessive grease I put on the shaft I think). So I used the wire wheel on my bench grinder to clean them up & now it runs like a dream!!!
THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP!!
THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP!!
wow yeah thats a parasitic over time thing. Good to hear you got it worked out. I'm in my final steps of setting my kit up. I'm Red Coat treating my new tank the stuff takes 24 hours to cure. I will have my kit ready for the first start and adjustments by the end of the weekend.
Cheers to all,
Cheers to all,
