Has anybody tried having the engine drive the gear casette?

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Mozenrath

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Jan 13, 2011
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I'm interested in getting my bike to go as fast as possible. I know that this isn't possible for variable street environments, but I'd like to see how fast I can go at a racetrack or something like that where I have room to gain speed.

The smallest drive sprocket I could find for the standard MB sprocket clamp is 26 tooth. But I want a sprocket smaller than that.

On the rear wheel on my mountain bike, the smallest sprocket on the casette is 14 tooth, so this got me thinkin':

Is there any reason why I couldn't somehow flip the wheel to the other side so that the engine could drive a sprocket on the casette? The only problems I could see would be keeping the chain from derailing and making it so that the casette ratchets the other way.
 

wheelbender6

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Sep 4, 2008
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It would be much easier to use an off-the-shelf jackshaft/shift kit like the one from Sick Bike Parts to drive the cogs on the pedal side, IMHO.
 

moonerdizzle

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you could try to find an old DK Dualdrive Flip flop bmx hub. Its got sealed bearings, and you can run a 13 tooth freewheel up to a 20 tooth on both sides. Left or right. It does have 14mm axles. But you can buy slotted axles to fit 14mm into 3/8s drop outs.
DK-Dual-Drive-Hubs
 

Mozenrath

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It would be much easier to use an off-the-shelf jackshaft/shift kit like the one from Sick Bike Parts to drive the cogs on the pedal side, IMHO.
Right, but then wouldn't that turn the bike into a giant egg-beater?

I guess I should have asked this in the past, but I've always been confused by how shift kits work on the pedal side.
 

5-7HEAVEN

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Aug 2, 2008
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you could try to find an old DK Dualdrive Flip flop bmx hub. Its got sealed bearings, and you can run a 13 tooth freewheel up to a 20 tooth on both sides. Left or right. It does have 14mm axles. But you can buy slotted axles to fit 14mm into 3/8s drop outs.
DK-Dual-Drive-Hubs
I'm guessing that sprockets on both sides are threaded for right-hand freewheels. That's why they flip-flop, so the rider can change gearing.

Wouldn't that mean that the sprocket would freewheel on the left side, if you try to drive it with a left-side :-||chain??
 

moonerdizzle

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I'm guessing that sprockets on both sides are threaded for right-hand freewheels. That's why they flip-flop, so the rider can change gearing.

Wouldn't that mean that the sprocket would freewheel on the left side, if you try to drive it with a left-side :-||chain??

No,the DK Dualdrive was nice in the fact that you could run 13-20 tooth left and right hand threaded freewheels. The right side of the hub has right handed threads, the left has left handed threads. If you go to the link I posted before you can see that they have a threaded adapter for each side that allows the use of a normal 15 tooth or larger freewheel. I know this for a fact because when I was younger I ran a Dualdrive hub on my Haro F3. Left side drive with 39-14 gearing and a full bash guard sprocket.
 

moonerdizzle

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"DK bicycles introduced the dual drive hub which is a BMX Left/Right drive flip flop hub with the smaller sized metric (30 mm x 1 mm) BMX threads for 13T-15T freewheels, but also includes two threaded adapters, one left and one right, threaded inside to match the smaller metric threads and threaded on the outside with standard ISO threads. This allows the hub to use any size or combination of left and right drive freewheels available. Other companies like Wethepeople also made these dual-threaded metric hubs for a short time before cassette hubs enabled the use of much smaller rear cogs."


Wikipedia FTW
 

5-7HEAVEN

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I went to your site. All I could find was the picture, but no info or price. I'll go look again.
 

5-7HEAVEN

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No,the DK Dualdrive was nice in the fact that you could run 13-20 tooth left and right hand threaded freewheels. The right side of the hub has right handed threads, the left has left handed threads. If you go to the link I posted before you can see that they have a threaded adapter for each side that allows the use of a normal 15 tooth or larger freewheel. I know this for a fact because when I was younger I ran a Dualdrive hub on my Haro F3. Left side drive with 39-14 gearing and a full bash guard sprocket.
Ok, I believe you so I'm not doubting you.

Did you run a left-side chain and chainring too?
 

moonerdizzle

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I went to your site. All I could find was the picture, but no info or price. I'll go look again.
I don't think you will have much luck finding a price. They haven't been made in, jeeze, I would say about 5 years or so now. But when I bought mine from Danscomp I paid 89 bucks plus shipping for the hub.
 

moonerdizzle

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Ok, I believe you so I'm not doubting you.

Did you run a left-side chain and chainring too?

Yes. Since I grind on my right side I always had a problem with my chain and chain wheel hitting and snagging on ledges or breaking my chains. That why I went to left side drive so my chain was on the other side of my bike, out of harms way.
 

moonerdizzle

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Wow, that's awesome. I learned something today.

Here's what Staton has to offer. Too bad it won't accept a disc brake:

Rear 36 Hole 12 gage Hub Left and right hand threads: Staton Inc
I have been playing around with the idea of making a sproter. I don't see why you couldn't use the sprocket, as long as it doesn't have offset teeth like the kit sprocket. And just making a mount on your frame to accommodate a motorcycle or ATV disc brake caliper. it would simplify a lot of things, and you would have the luxury of hydraulic brakes and good pads. I have 2 spare calipers off of a Honda ATC and a caliper from my KZ400.
 

5-7HEAVEN

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I have been playing around with the idea of making a sproter. I don't see why you couldn't use the sprocket, as long as it doesn't have offset teeth like the kit sprocket. And just making a mount on your frame to accommodate a motorcycle or ATV disc brake caliper. it would simplify a lot of things, and you would have the luxury of hydraulic brakes and good pads. I have 2 spare calipers off of a Honda ATC and a caliper from my KZ400.
My present bike runs its power thru shift kit and cassette gears. I do have the Staton hub on the shelf. Maybe one day I might want to adapt a disc brake to it.
 

GearNut

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Aug 19, 2009
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Right, but then wouldn't that turn the bike into a giant egg-beater?

I guess I should have asked this in the past, but I've always been confused by how shift kits work on the pedal side.
A shift kit has the front pedal sprocket attached to a freewheel. This freewheel attaches to a specially threaded right side pedal crank. When the pedals are stationary and the engine is propelling you the freewheel free spins and there is no "eggbeater" effect on your legs.
When the engine is off or at idle and you operate on pedal power the freewheel engages and transmits your pedal power to the front sprocket.
It is just like the operation of the freewheel on the back wheel, only kinda sorta reversed.
 

Mozenrath

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Thanks for the explanation, Gear Nut!

Well I'm not sure I want to go through all that trouble to install a shift kit. I might just buy a smaller sprocket, put it on with the current 44 tooth one, and swap from one to the other depending on if I'm commuting or just trying to go fast for fun. I remember there was someone here who did this and used multiple master links to change to the correct chain length for whatever sprocket he wanted to use.

What is the smallest 9 hole sprocket I can get? The smallest I can find is a 26 tooth, but it's aluminum. I'd really like to get one that's around 11 teeth.
 

5-7HEAVEN

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Thanks for the explanation, Gear Nut!

Well I'm not sure I want to go through all that trouble to install a shift kit. I might just buy a smaller sprocket, put it on with the current 44 tooth one, and swap from one to the other depending on if I'm commuting or just trying to go fast for fun. I remember there was someone here who did this and used multiple master links to change to the correct chain length for whatever sprocket he wanted to use.

What is the smallest 9 hole sprocket I can get? The smallest I can find is a 26 tooth, but it's aluminum. I'd really like to get one that's around 11 teeth.
An 11-tooth sprocket will NOT work for any Happy Time engine. Why? Let's work the numbers.

HT engine has built-in 4.1 gear reduction and 10t sprocket. With a 44t rear sprocket, that's 18.04:1...

With 36t, that's 14.76:1.....

With 26t sprocket, that's 10.66:1

With 11t, that's 4.51:1.....:-||

Besides, the 9-hole radius is probably larger in diameter than an 11t sprocket.
 
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