Battery battery, who's got the battery dope

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deacon

deacon

minor bike philosopher
Jan 15, 2008
8,114
9
0
north carolina
I am trying to make a basic decision here today. I want more range but I do not want huge battery packs. So I'm rethinking my choices.

Now I know that I can run either bike on 24 or 36 bolts. The range on the bikes does not change. I am simply adding power with the third battery. A good compromise power setup is five hundred watts no matter what the configuration. Ie a five hundred watt motor at 24 volts is about the same as a 350 watt motor at 36volts. If you watch ebay and take your time you can buy a 500 watt motor for about the same price as a 350 watt motor.

If I went with the 500 watt at 24volts what would I lose. I would lose speed of course but I seldom use that speed anywhere but for climbing hills. The 500 watt at 36 climbs like a mountain goat and at a decent speed. It runs very close to the stock china bike kit in most ways. A little slower but with the same torque I think.

I am really torn here... I can not justify the higher price of the lith poly packs. So do I go back to the 24v pack and sacrifice the speed or just bite the bullet and redesign the trailers so that I can pull both battery packs to add a couple of more miles range.

Has anyone else been faced with t his decision?
 
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Russell

Russell

Well-Known Member
Apr 19, 2009
1,276
155
63
MA
Deacon,
What type and size AH are you now using on your 24/36v setup? Are you using a hub motor?
Russ
 
geeksquid

geeksquid

New Member
Feb 14, 2008
114
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0
deacon said:
I am trying to make a basic decision here today. I want more range but I do not want huge battery packs. So I'm rethinking my choices.

Now I know that I can run either bike on 24 or 36 bolts. The range on the bikes does not change. I am simply adding power with the third battery. A good compromise power setup is five hundred watts no matter what the configuration. Ie a five hundred watt motor at 24 volts is about the same as a 350 watt motor at 36volts. If you watch ebay and take your time you can buy a 500 watt motor for about the same price as a 350 watt motor.

If I went with the 500 watt at 24volts what would I lose. I would lose speed of course but I seldom use that speed anywhere but for climbing hills. The 500 watt at 36 climbs like a mountain goat and at a decent speed. It runs very close to the stock china bike kit in most ways. A little slower but with the same torque I think.

I am really torn here... I can not justify the higher price of the lith poly packs. So do I go back to the 24v pack and sacrifice the speed or just bite the bullet and redesign the trailers so that I can pull both battery packs to add a couple of more miles range.

Has anyone else been faced with t his decision?
Click to expand...
I'm not hearing much good about the LIfepo4 lithium packs. They seem to sometimes just stop working.
Here's a battery that will end all your troubles.
http://www.advancedbattery.com/mmABS/Images/24V20T4LT.gif
 
deacon

deacon

minor bike philosopher
Jan 15, 2008
8,114
9
0
north carolina
I have a hub motor that I never use at all. I don't like it. I run ebikes that I build from parts that are used for other things. The one I am running at the moment is the rear wheel of a scooter sitting on top of the rear wheel of a bike. Powered by a 500 watt scooter motor using a #25 chain drive system. I used the same set up with 16 inch kids bike rear wheels at a pusher trailer.

I have decided to go with the speed. One battery pack is a 36v (3) 12v 12ah batteies and the other is the same but with 7ah. I have decided to use each alone the piggy back them if I need a longer range. I also pull the batteries in a trailer made from the front wheels of a couple of scooters. They are housed in a small plastic tool box from dollar tree. The 12ah fit perfectly.

When I next buy I am going for the 20 ah batteries I think. With the two packs I can ride a short trip to the park then switch out the packs while it charges I can go to the store. When I get back from the store a couple of hours later I have enough power in the small pack to ride to the shopping center a few blocks away. I could do that most all day but two 20 packs would be the cat's meow.

I always wondered about the lith poly because there are so many wiring connections in the pack. The ones I have seen look as though they are put together by a bunch of guys sitting on a dirt floor in china.
 
Last edited:
Russell

Russell

Well-Known Member
Apr 19, 2009
1,276
155
63
MA
Deacon,
I know nothing about lith batteries, I use a 24v wheelchair motor. I run it through the gears on my 10 speed. However due to the fact that I tie up one fo my crancks two sprockets I only have 5 speeds. I am using two lawn mower battries, I have not been able to find the AH capacity of them. However for the limited use that I put on them they have served me well, but yes they are heavy and bulky BUT CHEAP! I would ASSume they are about 30 AH. The motor draws 10/25A depending on gear and load.
Thank you for the info.

deacon said:
I have a hub motor that I never use at all. I don't like it. I run ebikes that I build from parts that are used for other things. The one I am running at the moment is the rear wheel of a scooter sitting on top of the rear wheel of a bike. Powered by a 500 watt scooter motor using a #25 chain drive system. I used the same set up with 16 inch kids bike rear wheels at a pusher trailer.

I have decided to go with the speed. One battery pack is a 36v (3) 12v 12ah batteies and the other is the same but with 7ah. I have decided to use each alone the piggy back them if I need a longer range. I also pull the batteries in a trailer made from the front wheels of a couple of scooters. They are housed in a small plastic tool box from dollar tree. The 12ah fit perfectly.

When I next buy I am going for the 20 ah batteries I think. With the two packs I can ride a short trip to the park then switch out the packs while it charges I can go to the store. When I get back from the store a couple of hours later I have enough power in the small pack to ride to the shopping center a few blocks away. I could do that most all day but two 20 packs would be the cat's meow.

I always wondered about the lith poly because there are so many wiring connections in the pack. The ones I have seen look as though they are put together by a bunch of guys sitting on a dirt floor in china.
Click to expand...
 
J

jdcburg

New Member
Jul 9, 2009
150
0
0
massachusetts
No, #25 chain is smaller than bicycle chain. You might be able to use it as the 1st stage of a 2 stage reduction unit, however. AllElectronics sells a separate roller clutch sprocket that freewheels in one direction so I assume that is what the roller clutch on the motor is. They also sell an interesting looking planetary gear reduction unit for $9.50 PLANETARY GEAR | AllElectronics.com
 
deacon

deacon

minor bike philosopher
Jan 15, 2008
8,114
9
0
north carolina
I couldn't figure out the shipping without placing an order for the motor. Does anyone know what their shipping is.
 
geeksquid

geeksquid

New Member
Feb 14, 2008
114
0
0
jdcburg said:
No, #25 chain is smaller than bicycle chain. You might be able to use it as the 1st stage of a 2 stage reduction unit, however. AllElectronics sells a separate roller clutch sprocket that freewheels in one direction so I assume that is what the roller clutch on the motor is. They also sell an interesting looking planetary gear reduction unit for $9.50 PLANETARY GEAR | AllElectronics.com
Click to expand...
Your motor already has a gear reduction, no way I'd use another gear reduction on top of that. You were able to use bike chain and said what sprocket you used and where you got it, but I didn't understand what you meant by using washers as shims and having to alter it. The sprocket didn't fit onto the shaft out of the box?
 
J

jdcburg

New Member
Jul 9, 2009
150
0
0
massachusetts
Hi geeksquid - The motor I used, for a Razor Dirt Quad, is a Unite MY1016Z3. It has a gear reduction unit built in. It came with a 21 tooth #25 sprocket. I found a 9 tooth bike sprocket from ElectricScooterParts.com that would fit the 11 mm (7/16") keyed output shaft, but the hub of the new sprocket wasn't thick (wide) enough and the sprocket is held on by a nut and compression washer, so it would have been able to slide back & forth about 1/8" on the shaft. I used a chainsaw file to make a notch in 2 7/16 washers to shim out the sprocket so it would contact the nut/compression washer as I tightened it down.

I think the reduction on my motor is about 1:7 and the bike hub sprocket has 19 teeth, making the overall reduction about 1:14, good for me but maybe not fast enough for some. The 600 watt motor doesn't look like it has a gear reduction unit, so in order to get down to even 1:10 with a 15 tooth sprocket would mean 150 teeth on the driven sprocket unless you use a 2 stage reduction somehow. I was just ruminating on my next build, I guess, when I asked about the planetary reduction unit.

I don't want to hijack Deacon's thread, so maybe if we need to continue, we could start a new thread - jd
 
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