Survived my first stop by police

GoldenMotor.com

bluegoatwoods

Active Member
Jul 29, 2012
1,581
6
38
Central Illinois
We do have one problem with hand signals; often when we need them both hands are busy on the handlebars. An alternative that I sometimes use is to nod my head sideways at about the tempo of a car's turn signals. The motorists seem to understand. Though it might not satisfy a strict interpretation of the law.

About twenty years ago I had the opportunity to get to know the police dept of a neighboring town. Small city, actually. I got to know some officers better than others, but I was familiar with all of them. And I noticed something that I might have deduced on my own, had I given it any thought.

These guys were true 'knights in shining armor' where the safety and comfort of, say, your mother or mine were concerned. Great, great guys.

But if they perceived one as 'the enemy', e.g., prostitutes, drug dealers, gang members, wild and hairy outlaws, etc., there was no mercy. Not that they'd necessarily attack. But they'd watch very, very closely and pounce at the first mis-step.

Their perception of who was okay and who was not was based entirely on first impressions. And that makes sense. They're busy people just like the rest of us. Unless the person in question is already known to them, then they had no choice but to go with their 'gut instinct' about the person.

We can choose our 'look' and the way we act in public. But, right or wrong, others will judge our character largely on that look and the way we carry ourselves. Some of these folks have influence.

Of course, some of us can't choose. Since I reached the age where my hair became a very flat, indeterminate color --other than the gray-- and thinned out tragically on top, I've not been able to keep a wild, hairy outlaw look. I just don't carry it well at all.

So I look pretty straight-and-narrow. There's no real choice.

But the police don't give me a second thought, either.
 

Desert Rat

New Member
Jul 30, 2012
565
9
0
Apache Junctoin Az
first and foremost I did not start this post to be a joke or political
I posted it to help educate the younger among us.

And yes you do have to pick and choose your battles.

In this case I was completely legal, so why not!

Had I been holding, as they say, the moment I saw them following me I would
have confronted them with why they were following me!

I was raised to be polite and considerate but as I get older I find myself
becoming more of a constitutionalists "doesn't mean I can't still be polite and considerate."


one of the many things that started it happened 3 years ago

2 am Mom calls " take me to the hospital, I'm having a heart attack"
she wasn't but I didn't know that.

Put her in car, and one block away from hospital was pulled over for no reason

When the officer approached he said how is everything going?
I replied I'm taking my mother to that hospital right there.
then he started questioning her. First time I EVER blew up at a cop.

What I said even surprised me because I'm not a confrontational kind of guy.

" you'd better be a *&^*(&^ doctor if the first words out of your mouth are not
Follow ME. Now I'm leaving and I expect you to get your &^%$ Captain
out here to explain your actions " and I drove off, never heard from him again!
but I did track his captain down and was given the old "yes I heard and the officer apologizes this will never happen again. yada yada"

When did it go from " to protect and serve"
to " to conquer and divide "
 

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Desert Rat

New Member
Jul 30, 2012
565
9
0
Apache Junctoin Az
We do have one problem with hand signals; often when we need them both hands are busy on the handlebars. An alternative that I sometimes use is to nod my head sideways at about the tempo of a car's turn signals. The motorists seem to understand. Though it might not satisfy a strict interpretation of the law.

About twenty years ago I had the opportunity to get to know the police dept of a neighboring town. Small city, actually. I got to know some officers better than others, but I was familiar with all of them. And I noticed something that I might have deduced on my own, had I given it any thought.

These guys were true 'knights in shining armor' where the safety and comfort of, say, your mother or mine were concerned. Great, great guys.

But if they perceived one as 'the enemy', e.g., prostitutes, drug dealers, gang members, wild and hairy outlaws, etc., there was no mercy. Not that they'd necessarily attack. But they'd watch very, very closely and pounce at the first mis-step.

Their perception of who was okay and who was not was based entirely on first impressions. And that makes sense. They're busy people just like the rest of us. Unless the person in question is already known to them, then they had no choice but to go with their 'gut instinct' about the person.

We can choose our 'look' and the way we act in public. But, right or wrong, others will judge our character largely on that look and the way we carry ourselves. Some of these folks have influence.

Of course, some of us can't choose. Since I reached the age where my hair became a very flat, indeterminate color --other than the gray-- and thinned out tragically on top, I've not been able to keep a wild, hairy outlaw look. I just don't carry it well at all.

So I look pretty straight-and-narrow. There's no real choice.

But the police don't give me a second thought, either.
And that's just my point!! blue jeans T shirt 1/2 inch haircut
I look more like one of them, and normally I have had no problems
with them I even peddle when I don't have to, let a judge see me
peddling in a video tape and convict me:)

But with the racial profiling out here it's getting bad with the abuse of power
( mind you I'm a Caucasian saying this.)
A short time ago there was a little old lady pulled over it took six police cars
and a taser to subdue her.
A year ago some yahoo Director dressed his brother up in a sheet and gave
him a fake rocket launcher to walk up and down the street. 30 minutes later
one cop showed up! a real disconnect going on here!

And I will add one part that I left out of the story I didn't want the
perception that's how I get out of a ticket.


The sun glasses I wear while riding is also one of these video cameras
he didn't know whether they were on or not ( they weren't )
but they new what they were because both the phoenix police and mesa
police use them! otherwise it could have been worse.

now I've lived all over the country including rural Mississippi
where you have constables instead of cops so I am talking about here strictly
I know there are many good cops out there and I'm sure there are some here
but they leave me alone, so what's left?

Time for a ride it's almost 90 degrees here today
so no more soapbox till next time LOL :)
 

Mike B

New Member
Mar 23, 2011
2,256
7
0
Central CA
When the cop saw you swerve, that was probable cause.

Might just be another drunk onna bike.

But then you didn't sound drunk, so he was thinking drugs.

I don't have a problem with any of this, sounds like good police work to me.
 

NunyaBidness

Active Member
Jun 29, 2008
1,062
2
38
memphis tn
I agree with you to a point and the point is this.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse even ten fold more for officers
enforcing the laws.

now I was pulled over for not using hand signals and yet the law says I don't have to so why was I pulled over? boredom?

Article 8. Turning, Starting and Signals on Stopping and Turning

§28-756. Method of giving hand and arm signals

A. Except as provided by subsection B, a person shall give all hand and arm signals required by this article from the left side of the vehicle in the following manner, and the signals shall indicate as follows:

Left turn. Hand and arm extended horizontally.
Right turn. Hand and arm extended upward.
Stop or decrease speed. Hand and arm extended downward.

B. A person operating a bicycle may give a right turn signal by extending the right hand and arm horizontally and to the right side of the bicycle.
You're mis-reading the law. In part A. it says "...a person shall give all hand and arm signals..."
And then we come down to the exception that says if you're on a bicycle then you may give a right turn signal with your right hand. It does NOT say that you may or may not signal, depending on how you feel at that time. It says that you MUST ALWAYS signal and that a bicyclist is allowed to use their right hand for a right hand turn.

So YES, they did have every right to pull you over and you should have gotten a ticket for not signalling. That, however, does not give the police a right to search your bags. And I will always refuse to consent to a search, even if I don't have anything to fear from a search, they still do NOT have permission to search.
 

CTripps

Active Member
Aug 22, 2011
1,310
1
38
Vancouver, B.C.
You're mis-reading the law. In part A. it says "...a person shall give all hand and arm signals..."
And then we come down to the exception that says if you're on a bicycle then you may give a right turn signal with your right hand. It does NOT say that you may or may not signal, depending on how you feel at that time. It says that you MUST ALWAYS signal and that a bicyclist is allowed to use their right hand for a right hand turn.
I was trying to put a post together the other day outlining that, but it wasn't working out for me so I killed it. The law as written is giving the rider the option of using the right arm instead of the left, not relieving the rider of the responsibility to signal.

I'm old-school that way, always using the left arm, but it's a quick move to pin the clutch lever back and use the left as opposed to my right hand leaving the throttle and brake controls.
 

Desert Rat

New Member
Jul 30, 2012
565
9
0
Apache Junctoin Az
You're mis-reading the law. In part A. it says "...a person shall give all hand and arm signals..."
And then we come down to the exception that says if you're on a bicycle then you may give a right turn signal with your right hand. It does NOT say that you may or may not signal, depending on how you feel at that time. It says that you MUST ALWAYS signal and that a bicyclist is allowed to use their right hand for a right hand turn.

So YES, they did have every right to pull you over and you should have gotten a ticket for not signalling. That, however, does not give the police a right to search your bags. And I will always refuse to consent to a search, even if I don't have anything to fear from a search, they still do NOT have permission to search.
That's funny actually I would like to see your law degree.
after speaking to a lawyer it seems I'm right if you read #19
again the law is very clear shall means must whereas may means can
or might. and I would like to see the cop that can ticket me for signaling
as your post would seem to indicate.

And I do believe your misreading as it clearly states motor vehicles must
but bicyclists may.

so how does that work the laws never mention me making my bike street
legal with all lights as my new bike is, so does that mean they can ticket me for going above and beyond the law?

It says that you MUST ALWAYS signal and that a bicyclist is allowed to use their right hand for a right hand turn.
What you say makes no sense. If I were to go by your explanation
and since they are not specific about left turn signals, then they could ticket me for making that turn signal.
Not to mention that I've looked over many state bicycle laws and can not find
one that says what you indicate. could you show me that statue in your
state laws that hold up what your saying?

among many other states what I have found are these rules of the road for bicyclist

In Florida the bicycle is legally defined as a vehicle and the bicyclist is a driver. Bicyclists have the same rights to the roadways, and must obey the same traffic laws as the drivers of other vehicles. These laws include stopping for stop signs and red lights, riding with the flow of traffic, using lights at night, yielding the right-of-way when entering a roadway and yielding to pedestrians in crosswalks.

If they are going into such specifics why not mention turn signals?
easy enough to do, would the people writing these laws not have thought
to include that.

besides since I was clearly within my rights to say no to a search and you
know that ticked them off, then why not give me a ticket as I was prepared
for it?

Sorry I will trust my lawyer over you any day unless of course you can produce a degree in law! Sorry

And I will ad if what you say is true then why follow me on a bike when your
in a car for 1 mile just to find a reason to pull me over?
they wanted to pull me over for seeing me swerve to miss their vehicles
parked in the bike lane and they couldn't so they came up with a BS excuse
so they could do just that.
If you are interested take a look at 1:14 is the turn I came around where they
were parked ten feet beyond the turn and then pulled me over at 3:40
http://youtu.be/Foa30PUg_xI

Now after all that I will agree that it would be the safe thing to do but is not required
remember that law says nothing about making a left turn signal from the right it's pretty specific

B. A person operating a bicycle may give a right turn signal by extending the right hand and arm horizontally and to the right side of the bicycle.
 
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Desert Rat

New Member
Jul 30, 2012
565
9
0
Apache Junctoin Az
Bottom line my throttle and brakes are operated from the right side
unsafe to take hand off anytime! They'll have to give me a ticket! :)
Safety first at all times!!
 
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Desert Rat

New Member
Jul 30, 2012
565
9
0
Apache Junctoin Az
Final thought
And I will not revisit this thread again and a warning to the young riders out there.
The police are not your friends, they are not your buddies, they are not looking
out for you! their only job is to enforce the laws, even stupid ones!

Have a good one and ride safely!
Ron