Staton crankshift kit with Honda GXH50 motor comparison to Subura motor setup.

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dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
Fedex just stopped by earlier today to drop off a new Staton crankshift kit with Honda GXH50 motor and 16 to 1 gearbox, 14 tooth output sprocket, which I will be installing on an older Univega 21 speed bike that has some mid-range Shimano components, and will be used for some more extreme off road hill/mountain hauling, 400 lb. load capacities.

This will be my second Staton crankshift kit build and will allow me to compare differences between the Honda GXH50 and Subura 35cc motors installed on 21 speed geared bikes.

There will be a few other small variations to this second build, that I will document as I go along, and pertain more to ease of use and assembly.

All the pieces seemed to have arrived with the kit, so I should have a good 4th of July weekend putting the build together and testing its capabilities.........................Don

Bike and kit;








 
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Dan

Staff
May 25, 2008
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Moosylvania
Cool DT. Looking forward to your observations. I'm a big fan of the Honda GX and have always wondered about the alternatives.
 

yodar

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Jul 26, 2010
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Orlando Fl
Fedex just stopped by earlier today to drop off a new Staton crankshift kit with Honda GXH50 motor and 16 to 1 gearbox, 14 tooth output sprocket, which I will be installing on an older Univega 21 speed

All the pieces seemed to have arrived with the kit, so I should have a good 4th of July weekend putting the build together and testing its capabilities.........................Don


I am going crazy trying to finds a supplier who HAS a 49 cc 4 stroke motor ready to drop into a bike
Could you share your supplier info?

Yodar
 
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5-7HEAVEN

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2008
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I'm looking forward to seeing this 50cc engine on a shift kit.

It should outperform the Subaru in all aspects except fuel economy.dance1
 

kerf

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Jun 28, 2010
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Birmingham, Al
Honda's a lot bulker than the RS but I understand the torque is great. What's changed in the new Staton box from the old 18.75/1. I have been thinking about rebuilding mine for the day when the CVT's go completely away. I think I have a source for a CVT, think I'll buy a spare.
 

Lance Portnoff

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Mar 22, 2010
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pennsylvania
I just sold a frame with a ghx 50 and a staton gearbox, its a great setup, use mobil 1 syn oil and premium fuel, now building a frame with another staton trans and a brand new subaru 35, good luck with ur build
 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
Staton now appears to have all the wobble removed (previous build and others have had excessive wobble runnout) from the complicated front chainring/freewheel/gear assembly, and the thing runs near perfectly true, I am very happy to see this since the fix requires alot of dis-assembly, realignment, and re-assembly work, yea!








 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
The sealed bearing carriers for the crank axle are still a problem, it appears Staton is still only cutting the threads to half the required depth and therefore the bearing carriers will not thread into the bottom bracket housing. Previous build and builds by others have had this same problem, Staton needs to re-program his CNC machine for deeper cuts on these threads.

So I had to lathe re-cut these threads an additional .016" on the diameter to make them fit to the bottom bracket, which is no easy chore when having to pick up existing threads especially ones with a left hand twist.

Photos show bearing carrier threads that are too shallow before being re-cut, re-cut on the lathe, and carrier threads after the re-cut that now fit the bottom bracket correctly;








 

MaxPower

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Jul 1, 2009
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Sierra Vista AZ
I'm glad to hear there is no wobble to the sprocket but the bottom bracket threads are just a pain in the A!! I'm interested in how the honda works out.
 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
Succesfull installation of the re-cut sealed bearing carriers, crank axle, true running front ring assembly, crank arms, and pedals.

Surprisingly the front chain ring shifter works perfectly with the new front chain ring assembly, only requiring a slight adjustment to get a little more outboard throw to get the chain to shift to the largest ring.

Most time consuming problem so far was figuring out that I had the incorrect carriers identified, tried to install the left and right hand sides in reverse order................Don





 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
Well, the build has been going along just fine with the installation of the engine/gearbox, some small modifications to get these items tucked forward and as low as possible in order to minimize the high outboard appearance of the setup...............then ran into a major road block..........upon completing the rough installation of the engine/gearbox I decided to run a quick in-shop drive train test to see if everything was tracking and running properly, it was not.

Somehow the complex front chainring/freewheel assembly is not freewheeling for the motor drive side, causing 8 pounds (as measured with a postal scale) of drag force being transfered to the pedal side drive making the pedals rotate with the motor ring. The pedal side freewheel works just fine with zero drag.

Anybody experience this same problem and know of what I should look for to correct this situation?

Photos to follow................Don
 
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dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
Problem component solved!...........key slot threaded flange backed out of inboard freewheel until it could travel no further due to making contact with big chain ring inner flange area thereby causing the 8 lbs worth of freewheel drag.

Not sure what caused the key slotted flange to back out, possible incorrect washer spacing allowing this flange to contact the bearing carrier which in turn spun the flange.

Or, maybe I was the cause when I requested that Staton not locktite any of the chainring assembly in order for ease of part replacement and repairs, maybe if key slot flange were loctited in place then it would not have spun loose, didnt think it necessary at the time because it all appears to be self tightening but this assemblys various movements are complex and hard to follow.................Don











 

MaxPower

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Jul 1, 2009
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Sierra Vista AZ
really cool! did you put the black marker lines on the sprockets or did Staton? Do you have a picture of all the crank components disassembled and laid out to show how it's constructed? I've told staton about the bottom bracket bearing holder threads a number of times. Have you mentioned it to him?
 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
really cool! did you put the black marker lines on the sprockets or did Staton? Do you have a picture of all the crank components disassembled and laid out to show how it's constructed? I've told staton about the bottom bracket bearing holder threads a number of times. Have you mentioned it to him?
Hi Max............I was the one to black mark the various chainring components since there are no self indexing features and if anything gets off axis then the "terrible wobble" comes into affect.

Again, the secret to no "wobble" is to assemble the entire chain ring installation on the keyed crank axle, that way everything is assured to be on axis when all the various bolts/screws are tightened, bearings inserted, and freewheels cinched.

I told Dave I would get back to him about my findings on this build, maybe even point him to this thread for pictures and observations.

Sorry I didnt photo the entire dissassembly of the unit, only the problem area, wished I had thought of that before putting everything back together and testing it............test went perfect, no wobbles, no freewheel drag..............Honda GXH50 acceleration is very impressive even for a putter like myself.................Don
 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
any updates?
Hi Max, now that I have over 5 months worth of almost constant daily riding on this build, plus weekly excursions into extreme mountainous and desert off road rides.............everything has been de-bugged and is working perfectly, just performed the scheduled oil change and valve adjustment. This motorbike does just about everything that I want it to do, very reliable.

About the only capability that it lacks is deep-sand desert and creekbed performance that I may tackle by putting this same Staton/Honda-shift kit on to a Surly 4.7" wide tired mountain bike.

How is your new chainring freewheel assembly holding up? I was a bit concerned when I found out that these freewheels only used 2 sprawls to drive the assembly..................Don
 

MaxPower

New Member
Jul 1, 2009
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Sierra Vista AZ
How is your new chainring freewheel assembly holding up? I was a bit concerned when I found out that these freewheels only used 2 sprawls to drive the assembly..................Don
I'm really glad I sent it off to staton. He ended up having to replace the assembly and I doubt I could fix it if he had problems. He charged me an extra $30. He used red lock tight on the freewheels so I doubt they will come off in the future
 

dtj6ppc

New Member
Feb 23, 2011
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redondo
I'm really glad I sent it off to staton. He ended up having to replace the assembly and I doubt I could fix it if he had problems. He charged me an extra $30. He used red lock tight on the freewheels so I doubt they will come off in the future
Good to hear that your new chainring assembly is right and working out well. Its a shame our first units didnt work out perfectly, but I think that can be expected for the first year introduction of this new crankshift kit unit. Now that the wobble and freewheel problems have been identified and addressed by Staton, all future units should be problem free..............Don